As a clueless Avocado-Toast loving Millennial, I am deeply conflicted. Should I listen to a self-made millionaire and bestselling author or should listen to what the heart truly wants?

"KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time" (kngt)
11/13/2018 at 17:10 • Filed to: well duh, Ask Oppo

“Nothing you will do in your lifetime, realistically, will waste more money than buying a new car,” he tells !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! . “It’s the single worst financial decision Millennials will ever make.”

To make matters worse, “most people borrow money to buy that car,” says Bach. “Why would you borrow money to buy an asset that immediately goes down in value by 30 percent?”

The good news is, you can get a shiny, nice-smelling car without breaking the bank, Bach says: “Buy a car that’s coming off of a two- to three-year lease, because that car is almost brand new and you can buy it at that 30 percent discount.”

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

DISCUSSION (88)

Kim Jong - Healthy > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:00

it depends on your lifestyle. if you can afford the payments comfortably, why not?

me on the other hand, I don’t like to make purchases I can’t pay with cash and never have to worry about a monthly payment since I already have student loan payments, insurance, rent, utilities, and of course, BMW repairs.

Luckily the beaters I like are $10k and under.

For Sweden > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:00

What do Baroque composers know about finances?

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > For Sweden
11/13/2018 at 17:01

Don’t insult him unless you want to be Terminated

Kinja'd!!!

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > Kim Jong - Healthy
11/13/2018 at 17:05

If you go to any financial/investing forum they’ll swear that the best car for everyone is a 15 year old CamCord/CiviCorolla for $10K or under, paid with cash .

Brickman > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:08

But someone may have farted on the seats!!!!1

Gotta buy new and keep it for over 20 years.

CobraJoe > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:09

“Nothing you will do in your lifetime, realistically, will waste more money than buying a new car,”

They say “waste” like it’s a bad thing.

I say if you’re honestly able to afford it, and if it makes you happy, then it’s not a waste.

ttyymmnn > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:10

To make matters worse, “most people borrow money to buy that car,” says Bach. “Why would you borrow money to buy an asset that immediately goes down in value by 30 percent?”

Because I have to get to work, dips hit.

I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:11

Protip, only buy 100% depreciated vehicles. It's totally a great decision, trust me.

ttyymmnn > For Sweden
11/13/2018 at 17:11

Do you know why Bach had so many children?

Because his organ didn’t have any stops.

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > Brickman
11/13/2018 at 17:11

If they only sold Pre-owned cars as “Pre-farted” cars everyone would buy only new cars. Period.

Pickup_man > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:11

The only thing money is good for is spending. I wouldn’t call buying a new car wasting money, but rather not utilizing your money to the fullest. If you’re comfortable with where you are, and are comfortable with your long term financial outlook, then go ahead and buy the new car.

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:12

Nothing you will do in your lifetime, realistically, will waste more money than buying a new car

OH NOW YOU TELL ME.

Kinja'd!!!

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker
11/13/2018 at 17:12

Kinja'd!!!

Ash78, voting early and often > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:12

There are times when a new car makes sense, albeit those situation are slim and most new car buyers would be better off used. But then what would happen if everyone followed that advice (the slippery slope of moral imperative or whatever)? Hardly any new cars would be offered, and used cars would be much more expensive. So it’s like an ecosystem.

4 years ago we bought new (Odyssey)— we wanted something we didn’t have to think about, that could be a workhorse and get the job done. Used models were almost as much as new, so the gap was worth it for peace of mind. It has delivered on that expectation, for the most part.

My bottom line advice is this: Don’t just live based on your cash flow, make a detailed balance sheet every 6-12 months. See how your overall financial picture is doing. Cars WILL drag it down. They will. But if you’re otherwise doing ok and growing your net worth, then you can just consider a car a part of the cost of doing business. Or having fun. Or both.

If your net worth is minimal (or negative, or shrinking) then take the financial gurus’ advice first.

lone_liberal > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:13

It’s a pretty standard line but it fails to consider all of the variables. What if I can get a 0% new car loan and keep my cars for 10 years? What if the model I want has such high resale that a new one doesn’t cost that much more than one that’s two years old? There are always variables that have to be considered.

fintail > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:13

YOLO

If everyone followed these self-proclaimed “experts”, the economy would collapse, and we’d all be living in caves and maybe yurts if lucky.

“Self-made” claims are also often amusing.

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > Pickup_man
11/13/2018 at 17:14

B..B ut then I might never become a self-made (read: My r ich Daddy got me started) Millionaire and Best-selling Author!

For Sweden > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:14

But this is true

Kinja'd!!!

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever
11/13/2018 at 17:15

Kinja'd!!!

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:16

Plz send money.

imadick > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:16

They aren’t wrong. T he 10k cash part though, you can buy newer cars with that much.

Pickup_man > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:17

True, but your car will be newer than his, and that will make you appear richer.

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > ttyymmnn
11/13/2018 at 17:17

Mr. Bach will tell you to “Stick it to the Man” and become your own boss.

To learn how, attend his $1000 a day seminar and buy his entire book collection:

Smart Women Finish Rich (1999)

Smart Couples Finish Rich (2001)

The Finish Rich Workbook (2003)

The Finish Rich Dictionary (2003)

The Automatic Millionaire (2005)

The Automatic Millionaire Workbook (2005)

Start Late, Finish Rich (2006)

The Automatic Millionaire Homeowner (2005)

Go Green, Live Rich (2008)

Fight For Your Money (2009 )

Start Over, Finish Rich (2010)

Debt Free For Life (2011)

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > Pickup_man
11/13/2018 at 17:17

Why be a Millionaire when you could just look like one?

DC3 LS, Fuck Hyundai, now and forever > ttyymmnn
11/13/2018 at 17:19

Not to mention if you got a loan now, and then we saw real inflation, you could make out like a bandit.

Urambo Tauro > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:19

Pretty sure this applies to everyone in the current market , not just millennials...

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > lone_liberal
11/13/2018 at 17:20

Clearly he is not an automotive enthusiast , he is a money-enthusiast.

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > imadick
11/13/2018 at 17:21

No they’ re not wrong, just boringly practical.

Spamfeller Loves Nazi Clicks > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:22

ProTip: if they’re so fucking brilliant at making money, then why are they doing the paid talk gig circuit instead of laughing at mayors eating wads of newspaper like Bezos?

Ding!

SilentButNotReallyDeadly...killed by G/O Media > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:22

He's right, of course. But then SO WHAT!

Sovande > ttyymmnn
11/13/2018 at 17:23

Used car?

ttyymmnn > Sovande
11/13/2018 at 17:25

Yes, of course. I’ve only bought one new car in my life and drove it for 15 years and over 200k miles. Which makes the whole depreciation argument irrelevant.

Sovande > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:25

He’s not wrong. My 3 year old car had depreciated 55%. And it still wasn't a really smart buy.

GLiddy > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:25

The fact is that you can have nice cars. You just don’t buy them coming right out of the gate. Buy a car appropriate to your position and finances, then a couple years later stair-step up to a better used car with the sale of that one and the money you have put aside for the next one. Before you know it, you may have accumulated enough to start buying those cars that actually APPRECIATE in value.

Nobody should drive a Corolla all their lives, but if you aren’t a crypto/youtube/whatever millionaire at 23, you should carefully consider your car purchases as they are declining-value assets.

Now, everybody is probably doing great in this stock market (up till these last couple months of course), but I’ll post my personal WOW moment. Right before my mom died, she gave each of my kids a little over $25K for their college. I put the money into an S&P 500 fund. In 15 years now, each have over $100K. I never added any more to the accounts. About the same time I bought a $36,000 used Lexus SUV with cash. It got wrecked last year and the insurance company gave me $8000 for it. Sure I drove it for 13 years and with gas and repairs and all it cost me about $300/month. Still that’s cheap driving, but wow, if I’d have bought a $16K SUV and invested the other $20K the exact same way, I might have $80K today.

Do what your passion tells you, but don’t leave your brain out of the decision.

Pickup_man > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:27

What good does that money do sitting in an account? Would you rather have things, or numbers on a screen?

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:27

Buy a 5-6 year old old car at a 70% dicount

WilliamsSW > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:28

Other things that you should also not do:

- Travel - stay at home, traveling wastes money

- go out to eat (exception: McDonald’s value meals)

- go to concerts (total waste of money)

- go anywhere actually

- Drink alcohol

- Eat anything other than ramen noodles

- Buy clothes anywhere other than Goodwill

- buy gifts

- go on dates

- have children

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:28

I’ll never understand that way of thinking. Saving money is fine, but spending it can be a lot of fun

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > Urambo Tauro
11/13/2018 at 17:29

But Millennials ruin everything right, so it needs to be emphasized .

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > WilliamsSW
11/13/2018 at 17:30

https://www.reddit.com/r/Frugal/ will love you.

Alfalfa > I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker
11/13/2018 at 17:32

It’s great strategy, really. Works well enough for me.

Ignore the 2 broken cars in my driveway that I bought for less than 1k.

WilliamsSW > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:33

Yeah, I want to follow that guy’s advice so I have nothing but money when I die.

Sovande > ttyymmnn
11/13/2018 at 17:36

I have only bought one new car as well. I bought it new because the price was so close to that of a used similar spec truck (Toyota tax) and with lower financing for a new car the payments were basically a wash.

I don’t know that keeping the car for 200k makes the depreciation argument moot, however. Situations can change quickly and if you need to get out from under a car , it might help to not have to take a bath on it. But I certainly get your point.

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
11/13/2018 at 17:40

If it is Hookers and Blow, yes. B ut a new car? tough choice there.

Tripper > WilliamsSW
11/13/2018 at 17:46

I have friends like this, I don’t get it.

WilliamsSW > Tripper
11/13/2018 at 17:51

Too many people get so enamored of money, that they just collect it for what it is - instead of just realizing that it’s only a tool. A useful tool, sure - but just a tool.

People like that are really goddamned boring - I’ve met my share, and don’t keep them as friends.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:56

Meeting some where in the middle and buy an old VW

Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 17:57

I did convince my mom to do this as she is currently shopping X5s and GX 460s at Carmax.

nj959 > Pickup_man
11/13/2018 at 18:02

Depends. If those numbers on a screen are big enough that I’ll be able to retire before I’m bedridden, then sure, gimme the stuff. Until then, I’ll save money where I can without living like a total miser.

Chariotoflove > WilliamsSW
11/13/2018 at 18:04

Have done all these things. Can confirm.

kanadanmajava1 > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 18:04

$10k is still quite a lot. You could get 10 running cars with that amount.

1. Buy a cheap barely running car
2. Le ar n how to fix things
3. ?
4. Profit

S o what to with the profit? Buy a bit more fun barely running car.

Chariotoflove > ttyymmnn
11/13/2018 at 18:04

Exactly!

Eric @ opposite-lock.com > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 18:08

I disagree. The biggest waste of money is housing, bar none. Housing prices are ridiculous, the cost of upkeep is unconscionable, and selling the thing costs money.

Next biggest wastes are seminars and self-help books.

Also, they’re parroting a depreciation line that hasn’t been true in over 25 years. In the last 10 or so it is almost to the point where buying new is usually the best decision and in many cases it’s the best decision by far.

for Michigan > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 18:08

If you’re paying anywhere close to $10K for a 15 year old CamCord/CivicRolla, you’re doing it wrong.

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > Tripper
11/13/2018 at 18:09

My wife’s dad is like this. It kills me.

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > for Michigan
11/13/2018 at 18:13

You don’t have to take everything literally word for word. It was just an hypothetical example to prove a point.

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever
11/13/2018 at 18:15

He must have read this book. He just wants to be a Rich Dad

https://www.amazon.com/Rich-Dad-Poor-Teach-Middle/dp/1543626610

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker
11/13/2018 at 18:27

I love that time is the great equalizer when it comes to depreciaition. You can buy a 10 year old Civic or a 10 year old BMW for around the same amount of money. Just how risk averse are you, and how much are you willing to pay for maintenance? With those factors more or less existing from the get go – or at least past warranty – I’d say buying a car that has reached or is nearing its depreciation floor is where as a car enthusiast you can really have a blast.

Build up a little bit of a buffer in your budget for unforeseen repairs, and the world is your oyster.

JawzX2, Boost Addict. 1.6t, 2.7tt, 4.2t > GLiddy
11/13/2018 at 18:29

I should have bought a new car in September, I’m $50k poorer (on paper) sin ce then.

BeaterGT > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 18:32

This is as bad as Suze Orman piece telling people they won’t be able to retire unless they have millions and millions of dollars. Boy, do I want to buy one of her personal finance books now! Not surprised to see her mentioned in the article. This guy probably drives a brand new car.

Anyway, my toast is getting cold...

WilliamsSW > Chariotoflove
11/13/2018 at 18:33

Same. Do what I say, not what I do

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > WilliamsSW
11/13/2018 at 18:38

I’m having ramen for dinner...

AfromanGTO > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 18:38

Raising a kid costs more than a Ferrari. Screaming children or italian car??

Tekamul > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 18:40

I can think of something that’s a bigger waste of money. Buying a self-help/get rich quick book. They rarely provide any value whatsoever, and if you really want to read one, check it out of the local library, that’s FREE!

Nauraushaun > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 18:45

It’s the single worst financial decision Millennials will ever make.

Is this... really a millenial issue? My father has bought maybe 6 cars brand new. Surely it’s a bad financial decision full stop.

Nauraushaun > WilliamsSW
11/13/2018 at 18:46

I’d argue they’re all more worth it than buying a new car. New cars are just money in the bin, for what?

jimz > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 18:54

Sorry, but I don’t care about having a shitload of money. I sure as hell don’t care to die with a bunch of money. I’d rather enjoy my time on Earth while I’m able to, and have enough for the short time I’ll be retired. Basically my plan is to work until I can’t anymore, and past that the instant I start having trouble taking care of myself it’s time to go. Hopefully there will be legal options for that by then, otherwise Mr. Remington will get the job done. There is no way in hell I want to spend the last 10 years of my life in a wheelchair, unable to wipe myself while dementia slowly eats away everything that made me a person.

WilliamsSW > Nauraushaun
11/13/2018 at 18:56

None of them are absolute necessities of life, any more than a new car is.

But we each have our own preferences and desires - so we prioritize based on what we can afford and what we like best.

wkiernan > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 19:43

Yet I think there’s something to be said, from the strictly penny-pinching point of view, for buying something like a Toyota Corolla new, at least for car lovers like your typical Oppo who take better than average care of their cars.

I bought two Corollas (‘81 and ‘90) new, and I wasn’t your typical Oppo, I was pretty slack about the preventative maintenance, but I managed to get over 450,000 miles out of them with relatively few major repair costs.

Sure , I could have spent less money and got cars with a couple or three years on them, but of the used cars I’ve bought I only remember one where the previous owner hadn’t abused it one way or another so that it needed rather costly service shortly after I got it, and there was no manufacturer’s warranty on them either .

wafflesnfalafel > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 20:19

yep - it’s just choice. We all have free will - different people make different choices. He’s trying to sell books and consulting fees, (and more power to him.) Some of our Millennials at work don’t even own cars so they blow all their money on Uber - how is that a better decision...

Neil drives a beetle and a fancy beetle > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 20:40

Well to be fair his advice is pretty sound but there are exceptions(trucks and cars like the WRX). I am interested in the FIRE (retire early) people and they all go a step further ; cheap used cars only. Fuel efficiency and insurance costs low. I’m always a little sad when I get all worked up about making smart money choices and then I need to rectify that with my 996.

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 20:56

If nobody buys new cars where is the supply of 3 year old off lease cars going to come from? Also where is this 30% depreciation coming from, certainty not from any cars I would want to buy. I’m lookyat you Toyota Tacoma!

Nauraushaun > WilliamsSW
11/13/2018 at 21:10

I’d argue that buying a new car compared to near-new achieves nothing . Not life experiences or enjoyment with friends or enjoyment of any kind, it doesn’t make you more appealing or fashionable.

All it does is tell the world that you’re a victim of marketing. And perhaps that you’re vain as hell.

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 21:10

Kinja'd!!!

We should listen to this man. /s

glemon > Kim Jong - Healthy
11/13/2018 at 21:23

$ 10k and under is nice car for me, below is Lexi, purchased for exactly 10k, low miles, extremely reliable, kind of sexy

Kinja'd!!!

And this is a beater:

Kinja'd!!!

High miles, some dents and dings, $900.

Most people I know bought a new car sometime in their twenties and go t it out of their system. But I still know a lot of people who are making high five figure salaries and feel they need a new, expensive truck every few years, agree with money guy, not the smartest investment.

glemon > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 21:24

It is, but there are other, slightly tastier, flavors available if you shop around.

glemon > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 21:27

Yes, I get the point, you buy an older well maintained car with reasonable miles, you might spend the equivalent of a new car payment or two in repairs a year, but with any luck a lot less than a new car payment each month.

Svart Smart, traded in his Smart > WilliamsSW
11/13/2018 at 22:29

-have sex

Carbon Fiber Sasquatch > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 23:00

So I need to charge people $1000 to hear me talk and buy my books, got it.

Seriously though, how do people not see through his snake oil?

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > Carbon Fiber Sasquatch
11/13/2018 at 23:02

For every 1 intelligent person, there are 10 stupid suckers born every minute on this planet.

Carbon Fiber Sasquatch > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 23:05

“Think about how dumb the average person is and realize that 50% of all people are dumber than that" - George Carlin

PyramidHat > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/13/2018 at 23:31

Saving money all his life so he can die with a shitty car, goodwill clothes and used tinfoil...

PyramidHat > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
11/13/2018 at 23:33

Finding the balance is key. My brother always overspent a little on luxury items and experiences, so I had to bail him out, periodically... but he died unexpectedly, so he didn’t have to live with the outcome and he got to have the things he wanted...

AestheticsInMotion > Carbon Fiber Sasquatch
11/13/2018 at 23:45

What a terrifying quote

Future Heap Owner > ttyymmnn
11/14/2018 at 02:43

There are other assets that get you to work that don’t dip in value so dramatically. You might not even need to borrow for it. Plus you might even get something to wrench on too!

Future Heap Owner > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/14/2018 at 02:45

It’s so true. I never thought I wanted a new car until I read an article by Stef where she pointed out it means your butt would be the first butt to fart in it.

imadick > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time
11/14/2018 at 02:57

Unfortunately financial responsibility isn’t sexy. But you know what’s even less sexy? Whining that you’ll never be able to retire.

Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness > ttyymmnn
11/14/2018 at 07:30

Pretty sure that doesn’t require a brand new car.

Source:

Never missed work, owned one brand new car ( which happened to strand me more times than any old car I’ve owned ).